Curse

Solus_the_Deadly · Jan 13, 2007, 05:43 AM // 05:43

These are my thoughts on the elites..

Remember Pve is Over half the game which Bathalzar form excels in. Only a few skills let you hit Holy damage, none for over 20+ seconds though. Same goes for +40armor and speed boost. 33% is the speed second largest speed boost in the game(only behind the 50% for 3 seconds from dash), and for second In pve is incrediable. Bathalzar is a wonderful running/tanking/undead slayer Form. I ask the people who has already insulted this wonderful elite, Have you ever used it? Bathazlar is great for the sitution when you know what your up against (example Undead). Acyolte Of Bathazlar can wipe out a full party of 8 easily for a reason.

It's not hard to see that Melandru is the most powerful Form byfar. It gives acces to weary strike without the drawback, which is almost more powerful than Eviscerate and ofcourse, the only skill that gives immniuty to conditions.
You can combine Victorius + Chilling + Weary strike here for Massive Damage spikes.

O yeh, to those who think Grenths is the best form, ever tried rending sweep + hexed. Much better than a elite..

Lyssa is great against casters, and the elite boost helps to spam attack skills. Other than that theres not much use for it.

Dwyanas is just awesome with self heal and hex removal, but a healer in a party would work better.

Jegred2 · Jan 14, 2007, 06:15 AM // 06:15

Balthazar's used to be my favorite, but I have just started to love Dwayna's.

I don't see how rending sweep is better than AoG, AoG is unavoidable enchant removal that is used every time you use a skill. Rending sweep only works if the person his hexed, and you have to wait for it to recharge.

Evilsod · Jan 14, 2007, 09:16 AM // 09:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solus_the_Deadly

People seem to really dislike bathalzar form, when 40+ armor is ALOT of armor.
Bathalzar Dervish can charge into battle and completey wipe out any Minion Master or Ritlust you met in Pvp.
So can a Dervish sensible enough to bring Heart of the Holy Flame/Judges Insight along with any of the other forms. The difference is Lyssa could then walk up to the MM and slash it to pieces before its finished casting its 2s spell.

Not to mention its great use for Pve. You become a Very pwoerful tank, extremly fast and dealing holy dmg, you encounter quite a few units who take double damage from this.
Whirling Charge? Harrier Haste? Heart of the Holy Flame? Judges Insight?

People must remember having a Massive armor and speed boost which can last over 70 seconds is a huge bonus and should not be over looked.
Just a shame that outside of normal PvE you will never actually need to be chasing after something for 79 seconds or to be tanking for 79 seconds. Hell, you don't really need to chase them for 20 seconds if you don't waste the skills till you need em.

As far as PvE goes, Lyssa all the way.

hondy · Jan 14, 2007, 10:19 AM // 10:19

If anyone cared to notice about there coments on 1v1 with a deverish form, balthazar's could simply beat each of them. That is of course if were using the basic aspect of hitting them with a sythe. The +40AL for the form actually excists! Wearying strike with the melandru form is a fantastic combo but I fail to see how useful it will be once your form has been disabled.

No-one should be entirely relying on the forms for there builds since you cannot maintain them 100% of the time meaning there is a flaw in your build. My most used form is lyssa simply because I'm that type of damage player, also it means by build doesn't have to be entirely useless when I don't have the form activated, just more useful when it is.

I'm not much of a Grenth fan due to the fact that I like to play so I have an assured usefulness, I'd much rather bring a form that can be useful regardless of what I'm versing, since I might not be facing enchantments every single time I play with it. However I would activate it anyway because it makes my character look taller and cooler :P.

Dwayna I never really feel I need. I'm willing to experiment and see how I can make it work it more offencive builds because that can cover a lot of defence alone, regarding the fact I won't have it activated the whole time.

Melandru I love simply because it's such a solid defender, it renders one of the assassins greatest weapons, quick condition infliction, useless. Unless of course a fragily mesmer is present. I'm not sure if many people understand they aren't actually "immune" to conditions, just the duration is reduced to zero.

I can't really say if there is a best of each of them because in there own right they can change the tides of a battle depending on what there versing and the build to follow it up.

Thom Bangalter · Jan 14, 2007, 10:27 AM // 10:27

This is one of those threads when you see how many people are terrible at the game.

If there was to be a worst one, it would probably be dwayna's, and it's not half bad either.

Jegred2 · Jan 14, 2007, 03:33 PM // 15:33

lol, dwayna's avatar is awesome. The hex removal alone makes it worth it not to mention the health gain.

AoG is a bad PvE choice, but rocks for PvP.

All the rest have their merits

Dzus · Jan 14, 2007, 06:22 PM // 18:22

I'm not wasting my elite slot on an avatar for PvE.

Narfolik · Jan 14, 2007, 06:58 PM // 18:58

only avatar i rly use is Balthazar for running, and only if there is no need to take VOS, Grenth is somewhat usefull in pvp but if you dont manage to kill everything before it expires its like you didnt have it at all, so if you are taking it you have to kill fast but these days more and moer ppl dont use enchantments but preffer Rt spirits, what leaves u with a wasted elite spot, every1 killed monks before and a avatar that helps doing it isnt that much needed, you re probably better of with Reapers sweep

unlike in pve where your dmg isnt noticable(DoA) in pvp dervishes dmg outpot is huge, and you can do useful spells and self heal too, not harming dmg they do.

avatars are just nice for costume parties, but beacose they cant be always up dont have a big build potential

Skuld · Jan 14, 2007, 07:28 PM // 19:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dzus

I'm not wasting my elite slot on an avatar for PvE.

I'm with that.

Perma-avatar in PvE imo.

Jegred2 · Jan 15, 2007, 12:35 AM // 00:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dzus

I'm not wasting my elite slot on an avatar for PvE.

what elite do you use on your dervish?

CagedinSanity · Jan 15, 2007, 02:45 AM // 02:45

Melandru did awesome when I scrimmage'd an unsuspecting alliance member who was a poison/burning arrow ranger. It fun to watch him run away.

I have Dwayna now, and so far I've only used it once versus the mesmers/degen team on the Zaishen challenge. Dwayna simply does what one or two monks can do better in a party. In 1v1 matchesm i imagine that Dwayna very well could be useful.
I've also slaughtered powerful degen builds with Lyssa. And I'm PvE, so that's no small feat.

Solus_the_Deadly · Jan 15, 2007, 09:37 AM // 09:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dzus

I'm not wasting my elite slot on an avatar for PvE.

Wasting....?

jesh · Jan 15, 2007, 11:51 AM // 11:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

[skill]avatar of lyssa[/skill] + [skill]Twin Moon Sweep[/skill] + [skill]protector's strike[/skill] ^^

Eremite's and Mystic Sweep are also faster than normal attacks, plus.. sometimes you actually do get a bonus on the damage there. I actually skip Twin Moon and just take Protector's, Eremite's, Mystic, Heart of Fury, and orderssss + GFTE when I go heroway in PvE.

Guys you have to realize, skill does not equal spell. Lyssa's Avatar works on any skill. You get bonus damage for hitting a ranger casting Favorable Winds, or an enemy warrior doing Power Attack. This is why Lyssa's is so incredibly powerful in PvE. It's fun to give your orders spammer Meekness as well.

Skuld · Jan 15, 2007, 03:15 PM // 15:15

Eremite's and Mystic are 3/4, not half. I carry them in addition sometimes.. but you can't hit 1 sec casts without having v. fast reflexes.

CagedinSanity · Jan 15, 2007, 03:31 PM // 15:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by jesh

Guys you have to realize, skill does not equal spell. Lyssa's Avatar works on any skill. You get bonus damage for hitting a ranger casting Favorable Winds, or an enemy warrior doing Power Attack.

Then how did I destroy a degen necro, hitting him at 222 damage with only the avatar of Lyssa, no other attack skills used? I'm pretty sure he was casting a spell (3 second casting time, at least) but I didn't really pay attention. But I sure did see that 222 damage.

Tingi · Jan 15, 2007, 05:48 PM // 17:48

all spells are skills, but not all skills are spells

Turbobusa · Jan 15, 2007, 06:31 PM // 18:31

depending on the zone, I would alternate between lyssa and dwyna.
obviously dwayna in hex-heavy area, lyssa elsewhere.

less usefull in pve? grenth
less usefull in pvp? balthazar...

jesh · Jan 15, 2007, 08:48 PM // 20:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

Eremite's and Mystic are 3/4, not half. I carry them in addition sometimes.. but you can't hit 1 sec casts without having v. fast reflexes.

I realize that, but you can rarely actually hit something with Twin Moon at all. If you're lucky you'll strip your own order. That's why I don't take it most of the time. I use Zealous Renewal and a zealous weapon to use the attacks as soon as they're available. If what I remember is correct, an IAS will decrease the cast time for your faster attacks like Critical Chop, as well as your normal attack skills. The 3/4 second becomes less of a problem.

Thank you Tan, for saying what I was going to.

Coloneh · Jan 19, 2007, 03:24 AM // 03:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jegred2

what elite do you use on your dervish?

[skill]Vow of Strength[/skill] + [skill]Heket's Rampage[/skill]

SnarkFish · Jan 19, 2007, 05:57 AM // 05:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by knives

I didn't mean to interrupt. It acts the same as AC but has shorter cast time, recharge time, and longer duration. The extra damage is totally irrelevant. Spells take 50% longer = twice as long, no?

no
100% longer would be twice as long